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This pricing model will continue to incentivize them internally to not fix the hundreds of clearly documented issues that causes CI to be incredibly slow. Everything from their self-inflicted bottlenecking of file transfers to the safe_sleep bug that randomly makes a runner run forever until it times out. All of it now makes them more money


This pricing model continues to incentivize them not fixing the hundreds of clearly documented issues that causes CI to be incredibly slow. Everything from their self-inflicted bottlenecking of file transfers to the safe_sleep bug that randomly makes a runner run forever until it times out.


We are a ~20 person team who use private runners and this will increase our annual costs by ~12k/yr. This is a huge relative cost increase for us. If anything this hurts small teams that focused on expansive automated testing more than giant orgs.


gitlab


Not really comparable at any compliance or security oriented business. You can't just zip the thing up and sftp it over to the server. All the zany supply chain security stuff needs to happen in CI and not be done by a human or we fail our dozens of audits


While true, the mistake we made was to centralize them. Just imagine the case if git was a centralized software with millions of users connecting over a single domain? I don't care how much easier it would be, or how flashy it would be, I prefer much to struggle with the current incarnation rather than deal with headaches like these. Sadly, the progress towards decentralized alternatives for discussions, issue tracking, patch sharing and CI is rather slow (though they all do exist) due to the fact that the no big investor invests in them.


Why is it that we trust those zany processes more than each other again? Seems like a good place to inject vulnerabilities to me...


Hi! My name is Jia Tan. Here's a nice binary that I compiled for you!


This isn't really a trust issue. People tend to take shortcuts and commit serious mistakes in the process. Humans are incredibly creative (no, LLMs are nowhere close). But for that, we need the freedom to make mistakes without serious consequences. Automation exists to take away the fatigue of trying to not commit mistakes.


I'm not against automation at all. But if all of the devs build it and get one hash and CI runs it through some gauntlet involving a bunch of third party software that I don't have any reason to trust and out pops an artifact with a different hash, then the CI has interfered with the chain of trust between myself and my user.

Maybe I've just been unlucky, but so far my experience with CI pipelines that have extra steps in them for compliance reasons is that they are full of actual security problems (like curl | bash, or like how you can poison a CircleCI cache using a branch nobody reviewed and pick up the poisoned dependency on a branch which was reviewed but didn't contain the poison).

Plus, it's a high value target with an elevated threat model. Far more likely to be attacked than each separate dev machine. Plus, a motivated user might build the software themselves out of paranoia, but they're unlikely to securely self host all the infra necessary to also run it through CI.

If we want it to be secure, the automation you're talking about needs to runnable as part of a local build with tightly controlled inputs and deterministic output, otherwise it breaks the chain of trust between user and developer by being a hop in the middle which is more about a pinky promise and less about something you can verify.


Yeah this is mostly the "build twitter in a day" projects that conveniently ignore the reason these companies have 10,000+ developers is the 99.9% of the software that is not the frontend that actually makes the company things happen at the company. The much bigger customers of many of these companies being the advertisers and the artists/creators who have their own interfaces and analytics and billing and payment tooling. The business rules engines and feature flags with tens of thousands of rules that allow any of these companies to operate in subtly different ways for customers in different states, countries, and regions with different laws for accessibility, fair use, and using and storing data. The auth and security layers that often have multiple interfaces for employees, customer classes, partners supporting native-auth, oidc, totp, developer tokens, etc... Apps for a dozen or more different app ecosystems on hundreds of device types from the obvious web and phone-based ios/android to the less obvious carplay, watch, roku, firestick, etc...


Right, but if you just search for "house listings" you find zillow and redfin and other stuff. Becoming the new word for "listings" will tie specific brands to our use of language in very interesting ways. What happens if I register my app to a common word. In this example, can I take "listings" and astroturf my app to the top? Is this a new DNS "buying all the domains" race?


Sam specifically mentioned apps would go through a vetting process before they were auto-suggested by the chat. So, at least in the early days, I would imagine some of the basic shenanigans will be prevented.


I mean ultimately you’re in OpenAI’s world, they have even more innate control of language, meaning, and truth


It's actually hilarious to think of a scene where all the people on the bridge are shouting over each other trying to get the ship to do anything at all.

Maybe this is how we all get our own offices again and the open floor plan dies.


Hmm. Maybe something useful will come of this after all!

"...and that is why we need the resources. Newline, end document. Hey, guys, I just got done with my 60 page report, and need-"

"SELECT ALL, DELETE, SAVE DOCUMENT, FLUSH UNDO, PURGE VERSION HISTORY, CLOSE WINDOW."

Here's hoping this at least gets us back to cubes.


Getting our own offices would simply take collective action, and we're far too smart to join a union, err, software developers association to do that.


They’d just have an array of microphones everywhere and isolate each voice - rooms only need n+1 microphones where n is the maximum number of people. That’s already simple to do today, and it’s not even that expensive.


But not in paragraphs. Their written language in those forums is short form sentences that are a mix of emojis and almost randomly inserted words that are more akin to honorifics sprinkled in to convey tone "no cap" "frfr"


Bench seats are almost certainly not coming back in modern low cost vehicles due to side impact safety regulations. They aren't _illegal_ but its extremely difficult to meet those standards with a bench configuration and ironically probably why a budget pickup is less likely to have them. Cutting those corners by not having a bench at all is an easy way to save money in the design.

The hauling and towing is another one. Unfortunately batteries are much heavier than a combustion engine and take away from the total capacity of the vehicle. It's curb weight is 500lbs more than the 1998 Ford Ranger. Same thing, budget vehicle means budget suspension, so its weight lowers the capacity instead of increasing the cost of the suspension.


The problem with bench seating is not side impact but accidental steering wheel input during hard cornering. In the typical 10 and 2 hand position having your butt move makes your shoulders move, the shoulders make the hands move, and now you’re understeering. Understeering on a mountain road likely means death, and on other roads a ditch or hitting a phone pole.


Steering position has been taught as 9 and 3 for a long time now… but still fair point. You can add a bit of alcantara to the seat to help you stay in place though. My RDX has it for the sporty-ish trim and it helps.


It’s never 9 and 3 in a turn though is it. It’s more like 8 and 1. Or just 1.


It's actually more like 8 and 4 or even 7 and 5 to keep your hands and arms out of the way of the airbag


And then your problem is oversteering which puts you into oncoming traffic.


Skill issue. 100k miles on bench seats in full size sedans to full size pickups, including mountain roads, and nary a problem.


Literally survivor bias.


So you agree: skill issue.


> understeering

Is that even possible in cars with ESC?


I had no idea bench seats had such an impact to side impact safety regulations. Thanks for that insight!

It also makes sense that the total capacity of the vehicle would diminish, but at the same time, and engine isn't weightless (though neither is an electric motor). If I had 1,500 pounds capacity, then I should be good to go.


The rear seats of almost all new cars are bench seats though. Is side impact safety requirements the same or apply the whole side of the car?

I believe airbag requirements prevent this because the middle seat would require a console mounted airbag where infotainment systems normally live


I suspect GP is misremembering why bench seating went away. Bench seats for the driver can lead to steering errors which can result in crashes.


There are other reasons too.

1. Cars that offered manual options needed a center console. Japanese imports would always have a manual version, even if that version wasn't in the US. Same with European.

The only one alternative is a column manual shifter which is horrible to use.

You couldn't use a forward floor shifter unless you want to shift between the legs of the person in the middle.

There are dash mounted shifters but would probably hit the middle person's knees. Not sure since these are rare and usually European (fiat multipla) /Japanese

2. At a point a US safety requirement was all front passengers needed either an airbag or a automatic shoulder seatbelt, basically it ran along the door with a motor when the door closed.

Automatic shoulder belts were cheaper than airbags so manf usually picked that option but don't work with middle seats since they need a door/column for the rails.

3. Minor, but, additional side safety rules increased door thickness. Both sides pushed in more making it uncomfortable. Fine in rear but front, as you mentioned, is a danger to steering.

4. Smaller import cars due to gas crisis in 70s that US companies (eventually) copied that combined with reason (3) made the middle seat basically useless


> 1. Cars that offered manual options needed a center console. Japanese imports would always have a manual version, even if that version wasn't in the US. Same with European.

Maybe in cars, but even when trucks still had a manual option, the S10/Sonoma as well as the full size GMT400 had a bench seat in the 90s/00s and a floor manual shifter, and it all worked pretty well. None of them shift like a Porsche, but especially in the full size trucks the center of the bench wasn't too bad if you weren't a large person, and they're generally pretty pleasant to drive.


You're right though that a truck could offer a floor shifter manual or a column auto because it's an easy conversion.

European cars did have the 4 on the floor but that's dated and these didn't have an automatic for the US (afaik).

I'm looking at the period when bench seats died though. A major change in car sizes and the dominance of imports.


> You couldn't use a forward floor shifter unless you want to shift between the legs of the person in the middle.

I’ve been in one of those. And I may or may not have been the child stuck sitting there. Mercifully only a couple times, because I was horrified. It felt like a child had the power to get us into an accident. 0/10 would not recommend.


I had an experience travelling across Kyrgyzstan recently in the middle front seat. The gearstick was just to the side of my leg, but changing gears invariably meant hitting my leg with it. It was a long 10 hours.


Hah, I was thinking of the fond memories I have of sitting in the middle seat and my dad letting me operate the shifter for him.


You're 100% right, they are used in semi trucks where it's not usually an issue.

It's also a horrible shifter experience even for regular commuter cars where performance isn't a priority. Considering how it's one of the three constantly used controls in a car it would likely hurt sales in a sedan.


> Same thing, budget vehicle means budget suspension, so its weight lowers the capacity instead of increasing the cost of the suspension.

Leaf sprung solid axle is great for doing things on a budget.

But it's probably impossible to put one in a new vehicle because the hiring pool of the automotive industry is too indoctrinated against that sort of stuff at this point.


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