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> I was having some success at getting their attention by working for a very large company who pays them a LOT of money, but then they laid off everybody who was working on this


Sadly, the OSAID also does not require training data to be available. :(


Would love to see Kagi and Mozilla to collaborate.


I have too much respect for Kagi to want to see them overshadowed by Mozilla in any kind of partnership. In particular, I am a very recent but very happy convert to the Orion web browser which uses WebKit (not Blink, not Chromium, certainly not Electron, but WebKit) but supports both Firefox and Chrome extensions even in the iPhone and iPad apps, and has zero telemetry baked in and doesn't try to upsell you on a read-it-later service that was a questionable purchase by Mozilla even at the time it was made.

Kagi also actually has a business model. Mozilla has a teat that a US Court might order removed from their mouths soon as a possible remedy to sanction their Mommy in an antitrust suit; and looking at their 990, things are not looking particularly good for them if that happens.


Could be problematic since Kagi keeps paying Yandex/Russia and there's sanctions you know...


I weekly monitor for news that they somehow allow using Kagi without Yandex. Still hurts after nearly 2 years of Kagi using to drop them. Without using Yandex at least I could convince myself that my money at least directly won't flow to Russia. I could revisit the idea of using Kagi again.

Thanks for pointing it out, people mostly don't speak about it anymore.


Yandex is a godsend to get information behind the silicon curtain.


Google too.

Unless you mean specificslly Russian sites in Russian. But those are not going to be available for long since Runet is slowly separating and VPN is now as illegal as in China


No, even content hosted on YouTube. Some videos are almost impossible to search for even if they are linkable via YouTube. For instance, it's almost impossible to find the video of MSNBC hosts saying they will vote for Trump if Sanders becomes the Dem candidate. First result in Yandex. Both are vehicles for state propaganda obviously.


This is wild...


Aaaaaaand, its gone. "We can't seem to find the page you're looking for."

Archived: https://archive.ph/UEDWh


Sorry, but you screwed up royally. Scary to see that Snyk still does not see this.

Ethically, your work was even lower than that of those who test their AI tools on FOSS code, send in bogus reports and thus waste maintainer's time. Experimenting on unwitting humans and ecosystems is not okay.


OT: Has anyone ever gotten (proper) SBOMs for Snyks own tools and services? Asking because they want to sell my employee their solution (which does SBOMs).


Snyk is founded by people from the Israeli Army's Unit 8200.

I wouldn't install it if you paid me to, because it feels a lot like Unit 8200 pumps out entrepreneurs and funds them so that (like the NSA) they have their foot already in the door.


Wiz.io (who almost sold to Google for $25bn) also had founders from IDF Unit 8200. Dozens of other companies like Waze, Palo Alto Networks were also the same.


Conspiracies and politics aside, the reasons for the prominence of 8200 are somewhat boring: it's the largest unit in the IDF, in a relatively small country. Teenagers who demonstrate just about any degree of technical savviness get funneled into it for their mandatory service.

It's the equivalent of observing that SFBA startups tend to have a lot of Stanford grads at the helm.

(I don't have any particular love for Snyk as a product suite. I think most supply chain security products are severely over-hyped.)


> Conspiracies

Not when the dissidents put their name to paper.

  We, veterans of Unit 8200, reserve soldiers both past and present, declare that we refuse to take part in actions against Palestinians and refuse to continue serving as tools in deepening the military control over the Occupied Territories.

  It is commonly thought that the service in military intelligence is free of moral dilemmas and solely contributes to the reduction of violence and harm to innocent people. However, our military service has taught us that intelligence is an integral part of Israel's military occupation over the territories.

  The Palestinian population under military rule is completely exposed to espionage and surveillance by Israeli intelligence. While there are severe limitations on the surveillance of Israeli citizens, the Palestinians are not afforded this protection.

  There's no distinction between Palestinians who are, and are not, involved in violence. Information that is collected and stored harms innocent people. It is used for political persecution and to create divisions within Palestinian society by recruiting collaborators and driving parts of Palestinian society against itself. In many cases, intelligence prevents defendants from receiving a fair trial in military courts, as the evidence against them is not revealed.

  Intelligence allows for the continued control over millions of people through thorough and intrusive supervision and invasion of most areas of life. This does not allow for people to lead normal lives, and fuels more violence further distancing us from the end of the conflict.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/12/israeli-intell... (and that's from 2014)


I don’t think this conflicts with what I’ve said. I’m not claiming Unit 8200 is moral or absolved; I’m saying only that you will run into a lot of 8200 veterans if you interact with any Israeli startup, since it’s a massive unit. Assuming that those people don’t have opinions of their own is likely incorrect, as this letter demonstrates.


It's signed by 34 people… I guess we can say it's completely irrelevant.


> 34 people ... completely irrelevant

There weren't many Oskar Schindlers either.


Talent or skills is essential but alone is not enough. while the size and quality of the talent pool helps it is not sufficient to explain the success rate, considering that there are similar or better quality talent pools which are larger in many countries around the world, but they don't have the success rates Israeli startups and 8200 ones specifically have compared to their home market and talent pool size.

It is not some conspiracy either, success as founder has strong network effects and positive feedback loops, right mentorship, access to talent pool, or access to funding and people who can open doors all becomes easier when your network already has some success. Similar reason second time founders have it easier they can tap into their personal version of a network.

It is not unusual to Israel/8200, the valley itself benefits from this effect heavily after all.


Right, it's not about talent. It's the fact that it's an extremely strong network with a flywheel between defense spending and startup tech. The same things that make the US's startup industry indefatigable.


> benefits from this effect

"Benefits" from whose perspective? For instance, the Brazilians (the State apparatus, specifically) are also benefiting [0], but are their citizens [1]?

[0] https://www.jstor.org/stable/48595312

[1] https://idanlandau-com.translate.goog/2016/02/04/technologie...


benefits from the perspective of the startup, i.e. chances of its success or growth.

Who in turn benefits from that in terms wealth, power, influence is whole different topic for which i have no expertise, i was only talking about frequency of successes in startup clusters.


Incredibuild is on this list (at least with regard to current leadership)


Got better results with Syft


Lots of false positives IME


That wasn't my experience when I used Snyk at my last job, depending on your definition of FP.

For example, if you're using a multi-protocol networking library, and it says that the version you have installed is has a vulnerability in its SMTP handling, but you don't use the SMTP functionality, is that a FP?

I'd argue that it's irrelevant, but not a false positive.

I never had it get the version of a library wrong.


We (https://github.com/husqvarnagroup/smart-garden-gateway-publi...) are using systemd on devices with 128 MB of RAM and are happy with it. It solves so many problems one usually has to fiddle with, totally worth a few MBs of RAM.


Once again this kind of argument:

> "The reality is that if only a handful of companies and a handful of governments have the resources" to rebuild models, it is not a practical goal for open-source AI.

Any chance one could build a (working) system for training in a distributed way?

Because e.g. Folding@home was able to accumulate quite some computational power this way:

> Folding@home is one of the world's fastest computing systems. With heightened interest in the project as a result of the COVID-19 pandemic,[8] the system achieved a speed of approximately 1.22 exaflops by late March 2020 and reached 2.43 exaflops by April 12, 2020,[9] making it the world's first exaflop computing system. This level of performance from its large-scale computing network has allowed researchers to run computationally costly atomic-level simulations of protein folding thousands of times longer than formerly achieved.

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folding@home


Bradley is putting up quite a fight:

> Finally, rather than merely be a pundit on this matter, I am instead today putting myself forward to try to be part of the solution. I plan to run for the OSI Board of Directors at the next elections on a single-issue platform: I will work arduously for my entire term to see the OSAID repealed, and republished not as a definition, but merely recommendations, and to also issue a statement that OSI published the definition sooner than was appropriate. I'll write further about the matter as the next OSI Board election approaches. I also call on other software rights activists to run with me on a similar platform; the OSI has myriad seats that are elected by different constituents, so there is opportunity to run as a ticket on this issue.


I guess this is (much closer to) what Bruce Perens wants instead of the (current) OSAID draft:

> Nor is one necessary, because the original OSD works for AI. You need to treat the training data as source code, and you need to apply the rules to both pieces: the underlying software of the machine learning system, and the training data. This can get complicated because sometimes the training data expands in real time as the system gets more queries.

https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7254500...


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